The Icon Bar: General: Help getting an old A420/1 up and running
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Help getting an old A420/1 up and running |
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ch (12:41 11/11/2013)
CJE (12:07 12/11/2013)
ch (15:55 23/11/2013)
ch (13:14 25/11/2013)
filecore (07:30 28/11/2013)
ch (15:20 28/11/2013)
filecore (10:58 29/11/2013)
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CH |
Message #122770, posted by ch at 12:41, 11/11/2013 |
Member
Posts: 4
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Hi,
I've recently been given an old A420/1 and, having used them at school, would like to get it up and running, just for old times' sake.
Outwardly, apart from discolouring, it appears to be in good condition. It has 2 podules - a 5.25" disk drive adapter (together with the external Cumana drive), and a Computer Concepts scanner podule.
It's had a RAM upgrade at some point - up to 4mb. It must be running RISC OS 2 as there are no applications built in on ROM, and there is no RISC OS 3 splash screen at startup.
That seems to be where the good news ends.
The hard disk is still there, but is reporting errors when I click on the hard drive icon.
I thought I'd be clever and hold 'Delete' while switching it on - but that's reset the machine to the point where the hard disk icon has disappeared. I don't have the original system applications disks in order to run any config programs and get it back.
I have bought some blank floppies - I got them off that online auction site - I think they're the right type (they were sold as Atari ST disks and are, I think, DS DD.
When I put one into the Arc's internal disk drive, and click on '0', I just get an error saying 'Drive empty'. Right click, format, also just ends up with a 'drive empty' error.
Does this mean that the floppy drive is finished too? It lights up, and makes that familiar old 'click' noise as if it's intending to read the disk, but just continually reports that error.
So I'm after a bit of expert help if possivle. I don't mind buying an IDE podule and SD card adapter, but I'm worried that if I do, that might require software drivers that I won't be able to run if I can't get at floppy disks.
If I can get an SD card up and running, and the Arc looking at it, I'm assuming that I'll then be able to take the SD card out, put it in a Windows machine, run some software that will read ADFS, and copy new stuff onto it that way - am I right?
Thanks in advance for any advice! |
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Chris Evans |
Message #122771, posted by CJE at 12:07, 12/11/2013, in reply to message #122770 |
CJE Micros chap
Posts: 228
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Is the hard drive connected to the motherboard with two data cables?
If yes: *con. hard. 1
Reboot and you will see the hard drive icon again.
Re floppy: On A310 & A440 discs often didn't drop down into place when inserted. The A4x0/1 series were better but also sometimes had that problem.
Does the floppy light come on when you try and access it?
OS Version:
Bottom Right:
Stylised 'A' = RISC OS 2.0
Green Acorn = RISC OS 3.0/3.1/3.11
or menu over Switcher icon, up to info and right.
SD adaptors need to fit into an IDE interface!
We sell most of the bits you need, but RISC OS 2 compatible IDE interfaces are very rare.
http://www.cjemicros.co.uk/micros/prices/categories/upgrades.shtml#prerpc
[Edited by CJE at 17:04, 12/11/2013] |
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CH |
Message #122842, posted by ch at 15:55, 23/11/2013, in reply to message #122771 |
Member
Posts: 4
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Yeah thanks about the IDE - I've been in touch with you separately about that, it looks like I'm going to struggle to get an IDE podule for a RISCOS 2 machine, i'll look out for one, and also look out for some RISC 3 ROMs.
The floppy drive light does come on. |
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CH |
Message #122856, posted by ch at 13:14, 25/11/2013, in reply to message #122771 |
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Posts: 4
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Thanks for the support and help with this so far - I've not started making progress with this so I thought I'd post an update and see if anyone can help any more.
First of all - the floppy drive. I took the lid of the computer off and had a look. The Arc was supplied with an external 5.25" Cumana floppy drive that connects to a socket on the back of the Arc. The socket sents a ribbon cable to where the internal 3.5" floppy drive is located and plugs into some kind of adapter, that the internal floppy connector plugs into. The adapter then plugs into the floppy socket on the motherboard.
If I remove the adapter from the motherboard and plug the internal floppy straight into the motherboard, it works fine. However, with the addapter in, although the floppy light comes on, I just keep getting drive empty errors.
I'm wondering if there's some specific config I need - I tried *configure floppies 2 - but both floppy icons seem to have the same behaviour - both seem to light up the internal floppy, but end up with a drive empty error. There is a switch on the back of the external floppy connector, which is fitted into a podule bay, but it doesn't seem to do anything. I haven't connected the external floppy drive as I don't have any 5.25" disks.
Onto the hard disk, it spins up but the computer reports disk errors when I try to access it - thanks for the tip on *configure, that's brought the icon back. I guess it's a write-off. To be expected I guess.
Other than that, the machine is in good working order. It has a tracker ball rather than a mouse, but I'm getting used to it, although might get myself at least a ps/2 adapter when I have the budget as I think I'd prefer a mouse when playing the old games.
Kayboard is in good condition, as is the Taxan monitor although I'll probably just put an LCD on it to save space. It also has an 'impression' dongle, although as the hard disk has expired the software is not there.
So next step RISCOS3, then I can put an IDE podule in it and get an SD card in there to replace the hard drive. |
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Jason Togneri |
Message #122864, posted by filecore at 07:30, 28/11/2013, in reply to message #122856 |
Posts: 3868
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The Arc was supplied with an external 5.25" Cumana floppy drive that [problems]. I haven't connected the external floppy drive as I don't have any 5.25" disks. Wait, you don't actually have a use for the drive? Sounds like he simplest option would be to just ditch it and not worry about the issue any more.
Onto the hard disk, it spins up but the computer reports disk errors when I try to access it - thanks for the tip on *configure, that's brought the icon back. I guess it's a write-off. To be expected I guess. After this amount of time, not really a surprise.
It has a tracker ball rather than a mouse, but I'm getting used to it, although might get myself at least a ps/2 adapter when I have the budget as I think I'd prefer a mouse when playing the old games. Many games that old will tend to use keyboard controls only (ZX:/Return) rather than a mouse, so I doubt it's a massive issue. It depends on what you upgrade the machine to, and what era of games you're ultimately looking at. Many games also have both keyboard and mouse controls as an option (eg, Elite).
It also has an 'impression' dongle, although as the hard disk has expired the software is not there. Newer versions (for a relative value of "newer") of Impression don't need the dongle anyway, so if you intend to get a copy and start using it, the dongle will be redundant in either case.
So next step RISCOS3, then I can put an IDE podule in it and get an SD card in there to replace the hard drive. Old RISC OS 3 ROMs should be easy enough to find on eBay and suchlike, although odds are you'll find whole old machines being sold off for the same price, so it might be worthwhile considering a second machine and just plundering it for parts. As for the HDD replacement, I've had good luck with cheap IDE <-> CF card adapters, and I'm currently using a 2GB CF as my main drive in the RISC PC - which incidentally cuts out 99% of the noise (due to the rattly old Connor HDD that I used to have). |
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CH |
Message #122865, posted by ch at 15:20, 28/11/2013, in reply to message #122864 |
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Thank you - actually I did buy a second machine - an A4000 - but I've found it so useful that I'm not going to plunder it - most of the components would be incompatible with an A420/1 anyway.
Yeah I doubt I'll ever use the 5.25" floppy but it seems to be soldered in somewhere so reluctant to remove it completely as this would, I suspect, be irreversible. Thought it might be a good idea to keep it there.
Most of the games I remember playing - Chocks Away, Saloon Cars, Break 147 were all mouse controlled, I think 4th Dimension, as they were writing specifically for RISC / Archimedes, wrote games for the whole interface / experience - commendable really. I've tried Super Pool with the tracker ball - it's pretty good actually. No pushing the mouse the length of the desk when I want to hit the ball hard.
I've been very lucky, I think, with the A4000, that as wel as its own onboard IDE interface it has an IdeA v5 IDE interface in the expanstion slot, that seems to have one external and one internal connector. I've had an SD card adapter and SD card plugged into it and it works well.
The A4000 must have come from a school and seems pretty locked down, so I'll have to work out how to unlock it. First of all though I want to back the hard disk up, in case there's anything useful on it. |
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Jason Togneri |
Message #122868, posted by filecore at 10:58, 29/11/2013, in reply to message #122865 |
Posts: 3868
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The A4000 must have come from a school and seems pretty locked down, so I'll have to work out how to unlock it. First of all though I want to back the hard disk up, in case there's anything useful on it. The OS should be pretty easy to reset to defaults - hard reset the CMOS, and then just delete the !Boot and replace it with a fresh one (you can find archives online, but it'll be murder transferring it to the Acorn unless you have a CD drive or a network card). I recommend networking with any Windows or Linux boxen you might have, it's a lot more pleasant. Cards are cheap on eBay.
For clearing the CMOS, there are some handy tips in this thread (read the other posts in there for other hints and tips of where to find stuff).
To back up the hard drive, you might find it useful to use a platform-agnostic tool like the Linux-based live CD of Clonezilla, which can make a sector-by-sector physical backup of the drive, and restore it easily to another drive. The contents of this won't be accessible unless restored to another drive and plugged back into your Acorn box, though, so your best alternative choice is to zip up all your files inside of RISC OS and transfer them to another machine by FTP, CD, or whatever other method you like. Drive cloning has the sole advantage of bring able to recreate the disk if the original has a mechanical failure. Zipped sets of files can be transferred to a RISC OS emulator on any other platform, unzipped and used.
[Edited by filecore at 10:59, 29/11/2013] |
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The Icon Bar: General: Help getting an old A420/1 up and running |
